INDIANANGLER

Has anyone used the New Daiwa BG reel? If so, is it possible to tell me where it is Manufactured?

Hello Bobby,

I have several of them in sizes 3000,4000 and 5000. All of them are made in China.

My limited experience with the BG has been quite good, catching barra and MJs without any issue with the 4000 size.

Slight niggles are that the bail wire is quite thin and there seems to be little audible warning when a
fish pulls against the drag (when trolling from the boat).

Great value for the price.

Regards,
Kingfish

See below picture for the BG 5000, showing "Made in China."

Same for all other sizes I have with me.

Contd..

Bobby,

Did you visit your friends in New Zealand? If so, any fishing done?

Kingfish

hello

Daiwa bg reel is a very good reel for the price, but just buy the export version as it has better construction internally, keep away from the JDM version.
you can read all about it on www.alanhawak.com

Thanks

Agree fully about the JDM (Japanese Domestic Market) version.

Kingfish

Thanks Kingfish, BG not for me I have allergic reactions to Chinese Made reels. I almost bought the Van Stall VR reel until I broke into a rash when I heard it was made in China too :) :)..Well have finally decided to get myself the Saltiga Dogfight.

I did not go to New Zealand, instead went to India had a family wedding to attend and also finally did a good week long fishing trip after years, did not get much, just some MJ and small GT but had fun, it was nice to finally do some serious angling again.

I will go to the US later this year to Houston my brother who used to fish a lot too is getting us on to some Tarpon fishing, its mid season end June so look forward to that, my daughters are very excited and have started working out (weight training) already for this trip. New Zealand may have to wait till next year and I will go to India again next month end...I have to balance this all with work or I will end up broke

Hello Bobby,

Lovely reel , the Saltiga Dogfight..... although I am not too enthused about the Magsealing by Daiwa.

Looking forward to your forthcoming trip for Tarpon fishing in the States, they run big there compared to the ones we get in Australia. Let us have the full report and pictures, if possible.

Regards,
Kingfish

I had already decided on the Dogfight but I wanted a smaller reel, and the sealing on the Van Stall VR was the reason I was going in for it. I have one of the older US made Van Stalls that is still in the box and never used. But I really liked the VR, I was doing my purchase on line, because the site said made in US, but I wrote to the vendor and he confirmed it was made in China, so I backed off. I have the 4500 Saltiga and the Daiwa Freams, one Japan and one Thailand that I use very frequently now. I have only one Chinese made reel its a very small Daiwa that I had bought for my son to learn on, I threw the rest out because they all gave me constant trouble and vowed never a Chinese made reel again, thought the Van Stall still tempts me like the devil whispering into my ear... pssst may be it is good, buy it and test it out yourself...

I was watching several reel reviews on different channels and what for me was shocking is, now, a Good reel and all of these good reels were Chinese made reels, are expected to last 3 - 4 years!! This is what we have come to expect from our reels, it is like buying a smart phone or laptop...A good reel according to me is supposed to last a lifetime. That is why I would invest in a non Chinese made reel even if I have to pay 3 - 4 times more. Us anglers are the only ones to blame for killing the reel industry in other quality reel manufacturing countries, because like fish, we fell for flash and bought cheap Chinese stuff. Now a Good Chinese reel costs like $200 - 250, the damn Chinese Van Stall costs $450 - 500, you will spend $100 to overhaul it. We are all being screwed here and we just do not see it...we truly have become a disposable culture...so sad.

To put things into perspective the Freams reels I bought them perhaps 12 years ago. I paid $50 for the Thai reel it was smaller, and $150 for the Japanese reel. Taking Inflation into account a Chinese made reel like say the BG costs the same or is even more expensive now, have we not screwed our selves or what? The Japanese reel, on the first day I took it fishing it was late night, I was fixing my rod and kept it on top of an SUV rear end, my friend did not see it and swiped over it the reel flew off and fell on the bail arm (air bail), I bent slightly, I fixed it with plier and by hand and used it and have been doing so ever since, I have caught perhaps a load of good fish with it since and it have never been overhauled and is completely reliable. The smaller freams also works fine, one of the kids has dropped it into salt water but other than the wind gone slightly grainy it works just fine and I have caught a lot of fish with it, perhaps more than the larger one, but smaller in size.

Yes looking forward to the Tarpon trip, will post pictures if we get anything noteworthy...my brother was talking about going to a place called Tarpon gully..

All the high end reels I own are made in Japan, be they Stellas or Saltigas, as these are the reels I count on when going after fish that will seriously test you ... such as GTs and the larger Tuna with their blistering runs.

For gentler fishing, I tend to go for well known but cheaper models from Daiwa (BG),Shimano (Stradics) and Penn (Clash, Spinfisher) as these are good enough to handle barra, mangrove jacks etc. Plus losing one of these reels due to a mechanical failure or theft does not hurt so much.

These cheaper reels tend to be made in China because the original manufacturers have become greedy, not because we anglers necessarily wanted cheap stuff.

By making them in China where costs are much lower than in the US or Japan, the manufacturer has a larger profit margin than if they made them in their respective countries.

We anglers do not get these savings passed on to us because we pay the same prices that these reels retailed for when they were made in the US/Japan.

We anglers have run out of choices, unfortunately through no fault of our own !

Kingfish

Forgive me but I do not quite agree with that analysis, it is only partly true, keeping the cost down yes but there was a time when you had a choice to buy US, European, Japan, Thai, Vietnam, Korea or Chinese. The same reel made in China was significantly cheaper and anglers bought them and kept buying then in spite of the failures and short life. So manufacturers would move to China because the demand was there for these reels. If anglers bought other reels and the demand for Chinese reels was not so significant then we would not be backed into this position. Now because of the Chinese made reel monopoly, perhaps manufacturers have gone greedy and put their prices up, that or cost to produce in China has gone up because of this monopoly, it is difficult or not economically viable to set up a factory all over again when you cannot justify a profit especially when the demand for where you are producing now is not making a negative dent, with our current disposable mindset and acceptance of mediocrity there is no need to. So I do blame us anglers for getting into this situation, be it out of ignorance or curiosity or just out of the fact that we like new toys...but now we have lost the value in the reels that we buy. Imagine $500 for a Chinese made reel and people are buying.

here's a bit of news, they are still making the old model BGs in Thailand:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Daiwa-Black-Go ... 3.l4275.c1

I agree that some of the blame may lie with anglers looking for the best bargain reel to be bought and this was invariably Chinese made ( for the big names).

If I remember correctly Korea, Thailand and Malaysia also made reels for the big names albeit for models that were more upmarket than those being churned out by the Chinese.

For example, the Shimano Stradic 4000FJ that I own is made in Malaysia.

However, over time, wages in these countries went up and they could not compete with the Chinese.
This factor perhaps forced the big names to have a rethink and start production of almost all their reels in China.

The Chinese are smart and have now started to make reels to their own designs and with Chinese names ... Kastking, Goture, Sougayilang are names that are readily seen on Amazon. It is only a matter of time before they overtake the lower end range of Daiwas, Shimanos etc.

I wonder if there is now an opportunity for Indian businesses to exploit the situation and perhaps tie up with one of the big names to manufacture reels in India?

Kingfish

Living in Hong Kong for the last 28 years I have been exposed to the Chinese brands for quite some time. I understand that the earlier Chinese brands were not so bad, but not so good either...I never got them to use myself. If I walk into a shop today there will be quite a few brands available. The way Chinese Manufacture things even the ones making larger brands is they produce a similar product on the side and sell it under their own obscure brand and the name will keep changing (if the envisaged success is not met...may be Feng Shui Related)

I have some Shakespeare reels that were actually Made in Hong Kong (believe me products made in Hong Kong and Tawian are of very good quality), these I have never used and are still lying in my closets in India and here in Hong Kong, I have gifted these reels to some friends who have used them with no problems, but these guys are not regular anglers, these reels are quite old, it was at a time with the Diawa factory was close to where I lived in Hong Kong when the Industrial area was still in Kowloon. They made rods for Daiwa and reels for Shakespeare. So I had picked up a few Reels, the Rods they could not sell me directly, I had to go through Daiwa.

My neighbor had given me an Indian made spinning reel to use several years ago when I was in India in my early teens, it was his fathers reel, I understand that this reel was given to Indian Navy personal only. I used it because I did not have the means to buy a good reel at the time. I did not catch anything on that reel, but it was not good and after a few uses the threading on the handle got so worn out that it the handle could not move the gear inside and the reel was useless, I did pack it up and use it for a while but I do not think it would stand the test to any decent fish. I returned the reel to my neighbor and replaced that reel years later with one of those Shakespeares.

I think any reasonable country can defeat Chinese Quality at anything mechanical, they cut too many corners and rely on packaging and jazz to sell their product but the consumers mindset is such that we will accept this because we expect to use something for only 2 - 3 years, dispose and get a newer model/Toy that looks oh so snazzy and has some features that we do not really need but must have.

Hello Bobby,

Thanks for that wonderful insight into the workings of the Chinese mindset, you have first hand knowledge of it.

You are correct in that we have all become members of the disposable society. Fishing reels, toasters,
irons, watches ... you name it ... it is now cheaper to throw these away when they give up working after a few years and buy a new one, rather than have them repaired.

Having said that, we are finding that firms such as Daiwa ( BG reel),Penn(Battle 2) and Tsunami
( Shield) have all come out recently with sub US$ 100 reels that offer incredible value and features at that price range.

No surprises here, they are all made in China! If the parent firm exercises strict quality control, the Chinese made product can be good.

One just has to be careful and buy after these have been extensively field tested and reviewed by
experts (Alan Hawk comes to mind).

Regards,

Kingfish

If I were ever to redo my surf setup I would do a Daiwa BG instead of a Penn Battle II and that's all I'm going to say. This after I experienced a couple of years old heavily fished BG from coworkers collection. This reel has fought some nasty Jack Crevalle, Bull Redfish and an occasional Tarpon or two (not landed) from the Gulf of Mexico waters. The reel is still way way waaaaaay too smoother, competes with my hardly used Penn B2 reel. I think it is a Chinese made reel, but closely controlled when it comes to quality by Daiwa.

Cheers....

Certain Chinese products are good, they make good Curtains and Furniture, even their electronic products (not electrical) products are very good. I have Chinese made sound systems/DVD players etc that I have been using for 15 years or more trouble free. The same cannot be said about their Electrical products like fans, light bulbs etc. It is the mechanics in these products that fail not the electronic components. The corner cutting mentality where the outside is great but the inside sucks is what they do best you really need to look at them thoroughly. To give you an example, I bought some expensive furniture a few years ago, Burma Teak from China when I re-furnished my house, all good looked great then after 4 -5 years I noticed that the China Cabinet and the Bar unit had some of their inside shelves collapse, on looking closely they had all these shelves inside made from MDF, The outside of these units were all Burma Teak this is typical chinese style

My son who worked in a Hong Kong RnD company used to go to China to work on some machines to improve their production time and process, hated going there because of the lack of safety and inhumane conditions in some factories, like concentration camps they lived on the camp, when the buzzer sounded the worked, had a half our break for lunch, shit etc and then back to sleep when it sounded again. Not all places are like this though...

If they can adulterate baby milk powder to cut corners/costs, do you think a fishing reel stands a chance?

For you to produce quality in China you need to have people from outside your people living there and monitoring the process from cradle to grave like hawks...

I just bought these lures and they are perhaps this is a good example of Chinese marketing/sales like what I was describing, here are two Identical lures sold under different brands. This could be the same manufacturer selling under different brands like what I described or separate companies/ brands, ordering/buying the lure from the same manufacturer.

On a side note, I do not know how these lures work, still have to give them a go, but the flat jointed lures realistic looking ones like these (shaped like Tilapia/perch/bream) really swim well. The torpedo shaped ones like these normally do not swim well, I will test them and modify if they do not work. Hope the open mouth helps with the flat lures the slant and depth of the forehead help their great movement and the tying eye is positioned over the mouth.

Strangely I bought a pair of the Lixada flat type just this week! Waiting for the water to clear up so that I can try them.

I got the flat one too, tried it in the US on some bass last month they move nicely, but the thing I have realized with chinese lures is that if one works it does not mean that the other will even though they are the same make/model.

Anyway did not catch any bass with that lure. I was actually wanting to catch crappie so was using live minnows and it was off season, finally managed to bag just one of a decent size. Caught a few bass ...I have an interesting story about a bait shop from where we picked up our minnows, I will post that seperately.

Getting back to this topic:

1. I have used these jointed lures, the movement is fantastic, I could get one of them to move so naturally that you would be forgiven to think it was a real fish foraging for food over the rocks. I did not use it because the hooks are crap and at the time I thought putting some heavier hooks on them would ruin the fantastic action. These are the flat type lures perhaps bops was referring to in his post above.

2. After much research I ran into what I believe is a fantastic reel, they claim it is made in Japan, the largest one has a 35KG drag. I bought the smallest one to test our first, it has a 12KG drag and it looks and feels fantastic lets see after a proper test out doors. But what this did was spurred me on the buy the heavier reels, I bought 3 of them and sent one to my friend in New Zealand, Got one for a Friend in Mumbai and one for myself. Once these 3 reels have been given a good working over I will fill you guys in with the details.